Using UFGT in Bonn simulation

[pga1965]

1/ Is it normal when using UGFT, in BONN (Ver3.2.0.8) to have to manually set point along that route, even when the tracks have lit, certain points do not. for example 203 >> 404 via alt. i set that route as i was writing this and had to manually set these points,,, 202,424,213,215. .......... this point now resolved,, ty

2/ I have an issue within version 3.2.08. that trains from Duisdorf terminating at Platform 5 (the normal traffic only, not the extra ones) originally had turn-around and renumber orders, now gone onto the next day and they DO NOT have orders anymore, also the shunt trains did not have any orders after the first day. ........

3/ I cannot find the OLE/catenary controls, i have selected to operate the OLE (OHLE in some countries) manually, but all i can find is the catenary overview. i could not find any info about this in either the manual or wiki. ........

Paul

[Helmut]

Paul,

look here for the use of UFGT http://www.railsignalling.org/signalwiki/index.php/Alternate_Route_Button

Playing over midnight still causes some problems. One of it is that all movement orders are missing. So you have to write new ones or better start the simulation again after midnight. Beginning at 00:01 hrs or later.

[pga1965]

ty helmut, i must have missed that no points are thrown using UFGT.

I loaded the sim up again after midnight and still no orders. I restarted BONN hbf and still not getting any preset orders.

[Helmut]

Loading a saved sim that was running before over midnight shows the same problem.

If you start a new sim and choose as start time 00:01hrs or later it should work.

[Gleissperre]

What do you mean with "manually set these points"?

Remarks:

* 404 is no valid destination for trains from Roisdorf/Duisdorf. Use 424 instead. Shunt is okay.

* If the round white light of a switch is flashing: Use WGT to put the switch in the correct direction. See the next two points.

* As a side-effect of the misleading implentation of UFGT it's possible to set a UFGT-route without putting Switch 202, 205 and 213 in the correct direction. A original signal box will reject routes without setting these switches to the correct position or set the normal route instead.

* As a side-effect of the misleading implentation of both UFGT and 'Weichenlaufkette' the switches 215, 204 and 121 won't go automaticly in the correct position. Use WGT to move them.

* Usage of UFGT how it should be: Set a shunt route from 243 to 433. Set another shunt route from 233 to 404. Then set a train route with UFGT from 203 to 424.

[pga1965]

What do you mean with "manually set these points"?

Remarks:

* 404 is no valid destination for trains from Roisdorf/Duisdorf. Use 424 instead. Shunt is okay.

* If the round white light of a switch is flashing: Use WGT to put the switch in the correct direction. See the next two points.

* As a side-effect of the misleading implentation of UFGT it's possible to set a UFGT-route without putting Switch 202, 205 and 213 in the correct direction. A original signal box will reject routes without setting these switches to the correct position or set the normal route instead.

* As a side-effect of the misleading implentation of both UFGT and 'Weichenlaufkette' the switches 215, 204 and 121 won't go automaticly in the correct position. Use WGT to move them.

* Usage of UFGT how it should be: Set a shunt route from 243 to 433. Set another shunt route from 233 to 404. Then set a train route with UFGT from 203 to 424.

Gleissperre, I was wrong in quoting sig 404, as this is only a shunt, as correctly stated the main signal is 424. the second posts explains this thank-you,

Paul

[Gleissperre]

OLE is often not aviable, but in Bonn it is.

You can find OLE switches at the last entry in the "Manage" menue.

You can find OLE overview at the third entry after the second line in the "View" menue.

[Helmut]

You can find OLE switches at the last entry in the "Manage" menue.

To see this entry you have to tick "manual handling of OLE switches" in the expert options.

[pga1965]

Helmut, I have selected manage OLE in expert, the last item in manage that i have is Movement Orders.

does anyone know why when couple order is issued why the drivers wont couple?

[Helmut]

Paul,

I don't know the options you have in the English version. But if you choose the default settings the couple manoeuvre should work.

For coupling it is very important that the denominations of the couple partners are writtenin the movement order exactly as in the train overview. So watch for small and capital letters or spaces between the letters and numbers. Also the track has to be correct.

The two couple partners also have to have the same coupling system. But locomotives and waggons normally couple without problems, also trains of the same type do.

If all informations are correct the couple partners will couple.

[pga1965]

should i be labeling a divided train as locxxxxx & wxxxxx?

[Helmut]

You may label it as you want. You can also take nicknames or whatever.That doesn't matter. But what you choose has to be in all movement orders exactly the same. Otherwise the locomotive cannot identify the waggons.

[pga1965]

i have train no. 1-43662, which is due to stop in track 206, (now also 1-66067 is the same) but will not proceed past the platforms, traveling FMZ -->> KKE. anyone have any ideas what is happening here?

Paul

[Helmut]

Paul,

As the train is due to stop at Bonn Hbf it will do so on every track. This is ok because it may be that you have to choose another track if the planned one is still occupied by another train. So the train 43662 will wait now at the platform until the time of departure (07:32).

I think there is a mistake in the timetable file. As tracks 206, 207,... are behind (or before) the platform tracks in a different part of the station called "Bonn Vorbahnhof" this part of the station needs another indicator in the timetable file than the platform tracks. Otherwise the programm cannot make a difference between the two parts. This is something to be changed by the signalsoft team. Until then all trains coming from the south will stop at the platform tracks no matter what track is scheduled. A train coming from the north can stop on the tracks at "Bonn Vorbahnhof" as scheduled. I don't know what happens when it proceeds. Perhaps it stops again on the platform track but will continue its journey soon.

What you can do is to call the engineer and give him the order to continue his journey disregarding the schedule. After a few minutes he will follow your instructions and proceed to track 206. There you can let him wait until the time of departure.

All trains with the numbers 66xxx are extra trains. They are a duplicate of an existing train with another timetable and without any movement orders. How you handle these trains is up to you.

Helmut

[signalsoftRC]

What do you mean with "manually set these points"?Remarks:* 404 is no valid destination for trains from Roisdorf/Duisdorf. Use 424 instead. Shunt is okay.* If the round white light of a switch is flashing: Use WGT to put the switch in the correct direction. See the next two points.* As a side-effect of the misleading implentation of UFGT it's possible to set a UFGT-route without putting Switch 202, 205 and 213 in the correct direction. A original signal box will reject routes without setting these switches to the correct position or set the normal route instead.* As a side-effect of the misleading implentation of both UFGT and 'Weichenlaufkette' the switches 215, 204 and 121 won't go automaticly in the correct position. Use WGT to move them.* Usage of UFGT how it should be: Set a shunt route from 243 to 433. Set another shunt route from 233 to 404. Then set a train route with UFGT from 203 to 424.

Can you define "misleading implementation"? Note that it is according to the design rules.....:-) so,where is it misleading?

[Gleissperre]

The problem is, that both UFGT and Weichenlaufkette are implemented in a way, that a small subset of sympthoms are reproduced correctly, but the rest aren't.

How does the UFGT work in reality? When UFGT is pressed, the signal box DOES NOT KNOW neither the default way nor the alternatives. Instead it will check if the "spitz befahrene Weiche" (switches, entered from the front) will lead the signal box form the start signal to the end signal. If all switches are lying as the default route, the default route will be taken. If all switches are lying in a alternative route, the alternative route will be taken. If the switches leads to another track, the signal box will actually do NOTHING. In other words: It's WRONG to implement UFGT-routes as a simple alternative to the default route, like SESAM does. Nor it's possible to prohebit any alternative route that is possible by the tracks. The signal box is not able to try out the closest alternative route if the switches are in a position, that does not lead from start to end. The resulting sympthoms are, that in case of Bonn Hbf if the switches are in the default route signalsoft is still taking the alternative instead of investigating on their own, where the switches will lead the signal box. I don't know if I can explain it better in German. Please ask if I should try.

How does the Weichenlaufkette work in reality? If you look carefull at a video of a SpDrS60 you will recognize, that the route is set much faster than signalsoft does. But the switches are stil in the wrong positions. Instead the round white light (Verschlussmelder) starts flashing. This happens both if Laufkette is locked or not. And in both ways you can use WGT to put the switches in the correct position wich will result in a persistent white light (Verschlussmelder leuchtet dauerhaft). But with Laufkette unlocked something is happening: The Laufkette runs througt the panel and start each 0.5 Second a switch with a flashing Verschlussmelder getting in the other position. (Umstellaufforderungen for Gleissperren or other switches with default position are excluded here.) So a route works both with locked and unlocked Laufkette exactly the same. The Laufkette puts only some work from the user. In Signalsoft it depends on Laufkette locked or unlocked if a Verschlussmelder is flashing. And in some rare cases - especially in this case - it can happen that a switch will remain flashing even if Laufkette is unlocked - that can never ever happen in the reallity.

[Gleissperre]

clarification: It depends on the signal box, how many swiches can be started each second. The critical point is the high current at the beginning of switching a switch. So don't thake the 0.5 automatic switch-starts per socond serious. If the main power suply is offline, the start-limit can be less, an the limit can be extended from a start-limit to a total limit of 1 switch total running (including manual use of WGT). Per default only the number of (automatic) switch-starts is limited.

And older versions of the switch group can require that not only the swithces, that are entered from the front, but all switches have to be in the correct position (excluding Flankenschutz) when using UFGT. But no switch required to be in the correct position seems to me like a myth. It is possible to have extra buttons for different Umfahrstraßen, but this is seldom.